00:04

greetings and welcome boys and babes it’s the magic hour it’s a place where we navigate through life’s peaks and valleys with all the vulnerability and shamelessness we can muster with the help of world-class guests from all walks of life we uncover new truths and valuable tools for manifesting our highest potential i’m your host mercedes terrell along with my partner in shine jade bryce hi today you guys hey today’s episode is going to be amazing it’s all about how to break free from over functioning

00:37

over delivering people pleasing and ignoring your own needs so you can finally live the life you deserve yes and before we get into that i want to bring up the fact that we are launching today as you are hearing this right now we are launching our very first virtual workshop we’ve done a few workshops in the past which have sold out and been amazing but i have a feeling that this workshop is kind of the cherry on the cake of our healing careers as it were this one is called awakening the king within and it is specifically for men

01:16

this is a workshop that we have put literally our blood sweat and tears into uh building and i’m so excited to offer this to the men in our lives it is uh something that is going to help men call in their highest selves essentially and um there’s a lot lot to that but if you want to check out what we have in store you can head over to awakeningkings.

01:43

com to sign up for our early bird wait list which by the way i highly recommend we already have more than 700 men signed up as of last week when i checked spots are limited so i’m getting a little nervous that we’re not going to be able to serve our whole community here so if you are interested in finding out how you can journey to the throne and awaken the king within then head over to awakeningkings.

02:05

com sign up for our early bird wait list where we will give you a 24-hour advance access to purchasing the course before the public gets access giving you a much better chance at securing your spot okay so with all that said jade you said that we are going to be getting into some fun today with um picking picking ourselves apart almost about where we are over functioning over delivering people pleasing all that good stuff so i know most of us were never taught how to effectively express our preferences desires or deal breakers and instead i’m

02:42

speaking mostly for myself here we hide our feelings behind passive aggressive behavior deny our own truths or push our emotions down until we get depressed or frustrated and we do that so long that we end up exploding potentially destroying hard-won trust in relationships if anyone else is raising their hand here besides me please chime in now so i don’t feel so alone but the most successful and satisfied people on the planet have one thing in common and that is the ability to create and communicate clear healthy boundaries

03:14

this ability is hands down the biggest game changer when it comes to building a healthy happy self-determined life you know that’s what we want for all y’all yes and our guest today is a psychotherapist that wrote a book on this called boundary boss which teaches a specific set of skills that can help you stop abandoning yourself for the sake of others without guilt or drama and consciously become empowered in every aspect of your emotional physical personal and professional life so let’s get her on mercedes

03:48

she is actually in the waiting room so should i admit her and then do this or how do you want to do this it’s too long of a bio so we’ll just read it afterwards and unfortunately that’s an editing nightmare but well i can just put her on right now you can just chop this and i’ll read it either way she’s it’s gonna take up too much time it’s a big one so okay hi terry hi ladies i was just checking my sound how you doing good good there you go your lighting looks awesome oh thank you

04:19

i’ve only had it up for the past four months now yeah this is what my house normally looks like not my huge is right in front of my face oh yeah i hope so and i love your book prop right to the left don’t even care you’re like book yeah yeah it’s perfect so um we’ll skip your bio just to save time and uh we’ll just read it when you get off and then uh yeah and then we’ll we’ll go ahead and jump in if you’re ready i’m ready i’m gonna give you your um audience a gift when we’re done it’s

04:51

like where they can go so i was gonna have it be boundary boss tap me forward slash magic spell like you spell it is that how you want it perfect yeah yeah and then we’ll also put it in the notes of the show so great okay cool awesome thank you so much cheers fantastic so i’m just going to read the last basically just introing you into the show so that it’s not awkward when you jump on from there if that makes sense all right so with that please help us welcome terry cole to the magic hour why thank you guys i’m so happy to be

05:23

here yes so we’re so excited yeah your your new book boundary boss recently came out and i recently started it and i’m already feeling the effects of it in my own life but realizing how much i really needed this book more than i you know would have guessed so i’m so excited to dig into all things boundaries with you can you start by just explaining what boundaries are and why they matter sure uh according to me the the definition from being a psychotherapist for two and a half decades is you knowing your own preferences your

05:58

desires your limits and your deal breakers and having the ability to communicate them in all aspects and areas and relationships in your life yeah and boy have i been since studying your work and coming to your work i have been like okay i have a lot of work to do i feel like like jade said like you don’t even know how much how much you need this until you really start diving into it um i’m so glad we found we found you and i’m so glad we’re sharing with you sharing you with our audience today i

06:32

wanted to ask you about the um boundary blueprint so what is the boundary blueprint yeah that’s a that’s a pretty cool tool yeah okay so this is in all of us have a unique what i call downloaded boundary blueprint so this is in your unconscious mind and it’s basically a paradigm right it’s something that’s already there and it’s dictates the way that we relate and express our boundaries so you can visualize it like an architectural blueprint for a house that someone else designed like maybe a

07:04

century ago or decades ago and it just keeps getting handed down from generation to generation because people don’t know to look for it so as a psychotherapist i always say that you know i’m going to help you go into the basement of your mind which is your unconscious mind and we’re going to get some stuff there’s material that needs your attention in some boxes and this is how we reveal your particular blueprint it has to do with what you saw growing up the culture the family the country you grew up in the gender the roles the

07:40

family roles all of those things come together and that is what is informing right now whether you say yes when you want to say no if you are over giving or undergiving if you do you know are you expressing yourself in a passive aggressive way because being direct is too threatening or you learned that being direct is rude right all of those things impact so really it’s about discovering why you relate to boundaries the way that you do because that’s the beginning of us basically changing the blueprint if it

08:15

isn’t getting you what you want so it causes an awareness that we can then work from instead of just kind of blindly going okay let me try this and that we’re like oh this is this is kind of my place where i start allowing people trying to transgress me so look look at that when it comes up yeah yeah and you said over-giving or under-giving and i didn’t i never thought of under-giving as a boundary issue so that’s an interesting thing to hear as well think about the think about over giving though for one sec like this is also the

08:46

dynamic in codependent relationships where you have one person who’s doing the bulk of the giving and the acquiescing and the you know like i’m going to maneuver myself to fit around your schedule because i want you to be happy and there is a tendency if you are a co-dependent even if you get into a relic if you have that tendency to over give want to you know codependency is really overt and covert bids for control i mean fact that that’s what that is so we don’t want people to make mistakes we don’t want them to be hurt we don’t

09:17

want them to be in pain so we want to tell them what to do and we want to make connections for them and we want to make suggestions and we want to auto fix and do all the things that really is a form of codependency so you can actually get into a relationship with someone who’s pretty normally functioning and if you are a big time over functioner you’ll notice that person starts functioning less doing less because you’re like i got it i got it i got it and in the beginning they might be like no no i got it

09:51

but if you insist i promise you you can turn a regular functioner into an under functioner just saying yeah i’m deeply an over functioner and that has been a big struggle for me and i think it does have to do um you know speaking when you’re speaking to codependency it does have to do with that worry of things are out of control in my young household you know growing up and then that translating into my later life of if i can make sure these things are all set into place which means i have to do them because no one else is going to

10:21

do it as well as perfect as i do it then i’ll i can keep it in control aka i can keep it safe that causes this whole storm of basically a burden that i carry with that carried with me my whole life that’s so insightful can i just say that that what you just said was so precise and so accurate and this is what is happening in so many lives and we don’t understand that it is those childhood injuries that are driving our adult behavior now there are things to do though and part of becoming a boundary boss which means

10:59

masterful keep in mind it’s not called boundary bully for a reason right because that would be still having disordered boundaries but the more you understand and sort of take care of and soothe that inner child the more evidence you have that you are safe now and that you don’t need to do that and when you really get that it blocks intimacy in your relationships because when when i met my husband i was such like what you’re describing very similar and nothing made sense where he would want to go out of his way to come pick

11:35

me up in new york city even though he lived in jersey and i’m like but in 20 minutes i could just take the train that’s not efficient why would you drive all the way here just to drive me back you know and my mother was like tara because there was a lot of things where he just wanted to do things for me because he just wanted to add value to my life yeah my mother was like i have a question like why aren’t you letting this guy who wants to do those things but do you see that you’re really denying him

12:03

the pleasure and and the connection that doing those things for you would provide and she’s like you know tara if you continue to reject those offers you will end up like me alone doing everything for yourself and by yourself like the offers even if you end up in a relationship the offers stop coming yeah if you keep rejecting she was like think about that as a gift if he handed you a tiffany’s box you would never throw it on the floor and be like i don’t need this i was like you are correct i would not

12:40

yeah that is both frightening and fascinating at the same time because i can see so much of that tendency in my life where i have been like no i got this i’m the independent woman i got to figure it all out yeah i mean even though i’ve been in relationship you know in these these devoted relationships but it’s largely where i’m much more devoted to the other person or at least that’s how it usually ends up and that’s been a big struggle for me i totally see that and the fascinating part to it as well for me is or layer i

13:08

should say to it as well is you know on the show we talk a lot about the masculine feminine um energy influence and i identify as that masculine trying to be the structure and trying to push the things to happen and taking too much of the burden is what it is so that’s really beautiful to hear it from from this way from someone who is the boundary boss and that i can you know i could quote unquote i guess maybe this is a very masculine word too but i can attack this from that angle of setting boundaries instead of being like how do

13:40

i get you know so ultra feminine that i out feminine him you know yeah yeah and i know my situation is the same where i um that was really necessary for me to heal here because i constantly turn down help even from a partner but i know for me it comes from a worthiness wound of feeling like i don’t deserve the help or i need to do it myself to prove my worth maybe um and i love that example that your mom told you how powerful um and i know that you you also talk about how most of us though were never taught how

14:17

to effectively express our preferences or desires so can you maybe give some examples on the opposite end on how that may come about meaning what how do you do it you mean or yeah well more just about how how most people were never taught like you were given that example by your mother but most people weren’t so can you talk about how that happens in in childhood usually yeah well i mean i can tell you from being in the trenches for 25 years with women like you women like me you know high functioning you know ambitious like want to be good

14:53

friends good partners good kids good sibling all the things we just want to do all the right things and we just want to be loving right that we were raised and praised honestly to be self-abandoning codependence like straight up we were be a good girl you know turn that frown around where’s my happy girl you’re like why am i turning it around i’m sad so we learn to deny our feelings if other people will be uncomfortable or if they don’t like it we learned that our value is in prioritizing the feeling states of other

15:27

people above our own and then if you grew up in a chaotic system my authoritarian system a system with a lot of addiction in it you learn this [ __ ] is not about you like you learn that so early because kids are so adaptive no we don’t need an inner office memo to tell us how to adaptably survive in childhood we want to get love from a parent who is unwell we if that means we are cooking dinner for all the other kids from six years old on then we are like we’re just doing it we’re not disagreeing we know not to provoke them

16:07

we’re not complaining we’re not saying what we’re not happy about because that might either result in being physically abused or just being rejected like kids don’t want that so there everyone has their own sort of particular story about why their downloaded blueprint is the way it is because it’s not just what we viewed of course we unpack it because it’s also what we experienced you could have the role in your family system i you know my there was a lot of alcoholism in my family and i was the

16:39

hero child people are like well that’s good right you’re like no no no role that is like thrust upon you in childhood is good you’re like that isn’t free it means you’re working as fast as you can to make sure everything is okay taking your talk about being raised and praised for being a co-dependent like be the fixer that’s literally your job yeah so that create create for me that created disordered boundaries as well but very similar to sort of what you’re both saying which is the the over giving

17:14

and then not allowing not allowing others to add value and i think i didn’t want to be a burden i also like you were saying percentage i think i just really felt like nobody is actually gonna do it if i don’t so you can’t trust it yeah right or or the perfectionist like you said or they won’t do it the right way right turns into women’s role right now big old dragon on my shoulder for sure and then and also i just add the the you know jade was talking about well what i see it as is that um where we feel we’re not worthy to

17:54

ask for what we need because then we become a burden and we end up apologizing before we even ask like so sorry but can you do this thing even though it’s like a fair question to ask or need to ask for yeah yeah i’m definitely not into the the over apologizing you know as like social ky do you know what i mean like literally it’s like this social lubricant yeah to like get around any uncomfortable thing and i think that what we have to really look at with boundaries is that you if you say yes when you want to say

18:26

no then your yes can’t be trusted yep and your no can’t be trusted and don’t think people in your life don’t freaking know that because they do they’re like oh yeah but she’s so sweet she said yes but it’s like 50 chance that she’s going to show up hmm they know yeah or because then we’ll will either go and be bitter totally that’s me it’s me yep where i won’t act it in the moment but like inside i’m like i don’t need this [ __ ] not a sunday yeah right like i didn’t want it to rest

18:57

today and then what i want to say to myself if i ever do that is who’s who’s making you do it like we’re doing it and then blaming other people right feeling like i was walking i was talking to one of my girlfriends i don’t know if you know kate northrup anyway she was like in the self-help business and she was like 15 years ago we were in the west village and she was complaining about this person who was asking her to do this thing and she just was going off like i cannot believe how entitled betty

19:27

is and she i’ve done so much for her how could she ask like going and i’m not saying one thing we’re just walking yes and then finally we get to where we’re going and i said yes she’s got some nerve putting you in the position to have to say no [Laughter] and she was like oh my god why don’t i just freaking say no i was like right we don’t need to like character assassin betty for freaking asking cause here’s the thing with people asking you to do things that are like ridiculous yeah

19:57

they can and they will and so instead of focusing on like the nerve of betty when you feel solid in your ability to say oh i’m sorry i can’t or actually that’s not my thing but i appreciate you thinking of me but i don’t like outside outdoor concerts it’s not my thing like just kidding that we’re allowed how about just saying no because i don’t effing feel like it yeah it’s so beautiful it’s revolutionary it’s literally we you know one of our questions for you was exactly that like

20:29

how having a choice to say yes or no like having a choice is sometimes just a complete revelation i know to myself to him like like you’re saying terry huh yeah i could say no here and that’s the thing is i’m why am i so afraid to say no here why am i wearing this mask of saying yes when i should say no all the time and yeah it does dig back down to my childhood for sure it does dig back down to those places that i felt unsafe to say no essentially for showing up yes and the child within here’s the

21:01

thing about child within work i can tell you before i became a psychotherapist i was a talent agent for years go checking the contracts or whoever i was like the first time i heard the child within i was like okay like i thought it was so like precious and weird and not real nice nice way to be judgmental but then i became a therapist and i could not believe because in my own therapy my therapist we didn’t talk about it that way even though we were healing childhood injuries when i became a therapist i could not

21:34

believe how powerful doing that work with my like it was undeniable it came up with every single person that oh there’s a phase there’s an injury there’s something that happened at this age that is keeping you stuck and that is what also happened so let’s get into what you were just saying about like it’s the childhood injuries that kind of make it so hard or almost seem impossible right it’s like in your mind you’re like literally yeah i cannot do it right feels like i’m i’m going to it’s like

22:06

close to death yeah yes but that’s how you know that it is a childhood reaction so i’m going to give you some tools right now so that we can figure out when you’re in a situation and you may it could be a repeated situation or it can be a situation that is very you know i had a situation where i was in grad school where i was at um an internship and i had this boss who like i friggin hated in a way that was not normal for how much i did or didn’t know him so i was going into therapy one week and being like i don’t like that

22:41

guy who runs a place like he’s written some books but he’s a freaking jerk and he’s cold and he’s mean and he’s judgmental and he’s unavailable and all of these things as if i had interacted with him a lot we do this all the time we do this is us so by the second or third time i bring him up in therapy my therapist was like okay i’m going to ask you something can you describe him i was like oh you know the type he’s tall good looking has he has dimples he’s like a wall you know he’s a

23:09

what i say he’s a brooks brothers suit were in wall street journal reading probably martini drinking a bit of golfs he’s like that guy he’s just like a jerk she’s like hello tara who does that sound like and then of course i was literally verbatim describing my father who i was afraid of growing up who was unavailable emotionally who was not a jerk but i was you know projecting he just was he just was emotionally not there right but he was someone that my sisters and my mother and i we all feared him

23:42

so i had this guy when i had this boss he would walk down the hallway and if i saw him i would literally dive into the ladies room to avoid passing him in the hallway well that’s a bit of an extreme response no for a guy who’s just my boss so anyways this she’s like do you know what’s happening and i was like clue me in because clearly i don’t because now that you say it obviously how did i not see how obvious it was that i was having um an amplified reaction to my boss it wasn’t a normal

24:16

reaction to the situation right it doesn’t mean i couldn’t have acted that way if he was like an abusive terrible thing but he wasn’t right so she’s like okay so this is so now we know you’re having a transference it’s called right to your father so imagine this in that moment i became my ten-year-old self that guy turned into my unavailable and punitive father in my mind and so my behavior at that job was now being dictated by my injured 10 year old make sense wow yeah and how do we get

24:52

there like how do we figure that out so you’re gonna use these it’s called the three cues for clarity so three questions and this is a tool that i share in the book and i’ve been using it with my clients for decades because having a transference that’s what’s called psychologically is really common which means i’ll just break it down quickly having a reaction in the present moment fueled by an unresolved injury from the past meaning something seems similar the person seems similar we feel similarly

25:26

threatened because something triggered like a memory sort of so anyway how we know that is when we have an amplified response or if we get hot really fast like something happens and we’re super mad super fast that can indicate that you’re having a transference if anything that seems out of proportion when you step back from it we’re like okay like i was like losing my [ __ ] over this thing that i don’t know when i look at it objectively i don’t think it should have been so you’re going to ask

25:56

yourself these questions because if i had asked myself these questions i would have figured that out long before i complained to my therapist about it who right now who does this person remind me of doesn’t have to be physical in my case it was but it doesn’t have to be personality energy could be the timber of someone’s voice the way they walk like so who do they remind me of where have i felt like this before which is so powerful yeah and then the third one is how is this interactive like the behavioral dynamic

26:30

the way that i was like in that case i was avoiding this person that i feared so that behavioral dynamic of him basically just walking around doing nothing and me running away to avoid him that was familiar because i was afraid so those three usually will have you bring to mind something where you’re like oh my god that feeling is familiar you can also say that the last thing you can ask is metaphorically who do i become and who does this other person become when we are interacting in this way yeah that takes some digging

27:11

i feel like like when i ask myself those questions with someone i have in mind right now it’s like i can kind of get a feel of it you know i can kind of get a feel of what i’m turning into in those situations but grasping and getting articulate with what that actually is well probably would take the help of someone like you or your book or you know like sitting with someone that’d be a surefire way well i think that really though if you it’s the most important part of this is understanding that there is a parallel

27:44

process going on when you are in a situation that’s painful when you are in a repeated something that you wish you weren’t when you’re repeatedly doing something yourself like falling down on yourself saying i’m going to stop drinking tomorrow i’m going to stop hooking whatever whatever the thing is you want to stop doing but then you you don’t stop doing it these are all indications that something needs your attention and they are an indication of disordered boundaries right you can see that the

28:12

way that i was interacting with that boss was disordered yeah and what my therapist said is she was like tara the reason it matters is because you’re grown up and if you run away from this person who’s your boss he’s never going to say how smart you are how capable you are don’t you want to get a job here when you graduate and i did and and i did after i stopped having this transference to him because the moment i realized it honestly for me the fear disappeared and i find in half the time half the time

28:46

maybe no about half the time my clients would go holy crap that was so obvious i’m so not doing that like you can just take something from the basement right that’s your unconscious and bring it to the main part of the house and transformation can happen like that and then there’s transformation that takes decades right it’s sometimes it’s just this power pivot where you go oh my god i have this relationship to authority figures because of my relationship with my father right yeah it’s like a

29:17

remembering like you’re just calling that online that you you knew it in the subconscious my dreams do that for me a lot i dream journal every morning and then you know they show me like hey you’re not looking at this thing and i’m like why are you hitting me over the head with this until i finally get it but yeah and wow fascinating stuff you you ended that with um who do i become and that one is such a big question because i noticed um [Music] just a couple weeks ago i realized when i was really digging into my abandonment

29:48

wound or my fear of abandonment um in meditation and it came this memory came back to me i hadn’t forgotten it i just hadn’t thought about it in a long time of a time when i was like three or four years old in a car and you know i was having a tantrum i was three or four so i was having a typical tantrum but the person driving the car said if you don’t stop crying i’m going to throw you out of the car and i didn’t stop crying and sure enough they pulled over threw me out of the car left me in this field and it was in the

30:18

middle of the night in a very empty field and i was there crying for i honestly think i may have cried till i passed out because i don’t remember anything after that but when i went there in meditation with someone we’ve had on the show tina rodriguez um we did an inner child healing where you know we went back and we cradled that little girl and brought life back to her but i realized that that same feeling that came up in me when that memory resurfaced was how i feel when i think that i’m getting broken up with or when

30:47

i think that he’s not answering the phone because he’s mad at me or whatever it is so if we can really like ask who do i become and that it’s especially when it comes to breakups it’s usually that little girl or little boy that feels abandoned by whoever the caretaker was wow that so much like witnessing you right now with so much compassion but the insight that you just shared is so it is so powerful and and in the moment when you’re in a relationship and you feel like that person might be stepping away or not

31:19

doing something in that panic you know that constriction and the panic comes up like the dread it’s in that moment that we tend to the inner child it’s at that moment saying hey you know what nothing has changed i just had this thought everything is okay right now and no matter what happens i’m gonna be okay so what would feel good what would be soothing is there someone that you can talk to like actually tending to the feeling so that you don’t act out the behavior in the relationship now you may be you know we don’t know

31:55

that you’re because i don’t know your history but whether you’re continually sort of having um this repeating boundary reality or repeating relationship reality as i call it but understanding that can literally be the difference between staying stuck and pivoting away where you go oh it’s about self-care self-love it’s also about instead of interpreting someone’s behavior when you learn to talk true you’re able to say you know you said you were going to get in touch last night when you got home

32:30

and when you didn’t i have to say it really bummed me out so i’m going to make a simple request that you just do what you’re saying you’re going to do whatever it is it kicks up childhood [ __ ] for me like i just don’t love it at all so it’s not that it’s a crime i’m not making you wrong i’m not super pissed off i’m making a simple request that you do what you say you’re gonna do now that i’ve told you that it causes pain for me when you don’t we are teaching people how to love us

33:01

yeah right by not letting those things slide i really am curious on the other side of that story if you’re a parent who wants to also be able to hold boundaries with their children and you have a children you know jade’s situation obviously is not okay but right but you know you get in a situation where you want to discipline your child or tell them hey if you do this thing then this is going to be the consequence of course be very careful right of what you promise is going to be the consequence that it’s something you

33:33

want to actually show up for there or not want to but will show up for it it’s not dangerous to the child um so how do how do parents in a situation like that where they’re being tested they’re triggered they’ve got all their stuff is it again about like almost like parenting themselves in that moment or like being aware in that moment so it’s kind of just the same whether you’re the parent or the child in the situation don’t re-traumatize yourself if you’re the parent don’t cause the trauma on the

33:58

child if you’re the parent yeah you can take a timeout though like like in jade’s on you know situation that if that person did clearly didn’t have the skills to but in the moment if you feel like you’re going to lose it as a responsible parent who has the emotional and mental faculties you remove yourself you you you pull over and maybe the parent the person whoever that was they get out they don’t of course do what they did because that’s obviously abusive and terrible but they make sure the kids stay safe and

34:32

safe from them and and there if they feel like they might be verbally or they might whatever you remove yourself but that’s why self-care itself is so incredibly important what were you going to say jane oh that just is so good to hear because i remove myself all the time i’ll go hide in the pantry for two minutes eating chocolate so that i’m not you know being any sort of uh abuse or traumatizing i just give myself a breath but my kids freak out at the point you know just at the fact that i removed myself so i’m just glad to

35:04

hear that that permission slip you just gave me without it trust me you’re like kids trust me the other side of this is not what you want it’s not you eating chocolate trust me yeah right oh man all right well so i did want to ask about something in the book you talk about high functioning codependency and the boundary challenges it creates so maybe you can tell us a little bit about that and how how someone knows if they are a high functioning codependent yeah that’s a good one i have a feeling just both of you should just put your

35:38

hands up right now the reason i actually came up with this new name for codependency was because the women in my practice were these very high functioning women high achieving women you know getting in doing all the things that you’re doing basically running the world and the family and the thing and the pto and the whatever doing it going to solo cycle like doing all the things and so when i would point out that i this was some of the their behavior was codependent i would inevitably have them go wait you’re nuts like hi i’m the one

36:13

everyone’s dependent on i’m the rock i’m the one that does everything that gives everything you know and i was like hello that’s called being codependent so i was able to have them see and this really is a particular flavor because back in the day when you think about you know melody babies seminal text codependent no more life-changing oh amazing and it’s been updated and it’s amazing but then it oh it seemed to always be like you have to be involved with an addict you’re an enabler that’s codependency

36:44

and i was like no because that isn’t and i knew in my own life that my own behavior that i had healed from was without a doubt codependency but i never would have identified it as that so here’s my definition is that if you are overly invested in the feeling states the decisions the outcomes right the circumstances of the people in your life to the detriment of your internal peace that is codependency and you’re high functioning right meaning you’re doing all these things i always say like you know they say about uh fred uh fred

37:20

astaire and ginger rogers right yeah but they say ginger rogers was doing everything fred astaire was doing except she was doing it backwards and in heels yeah so it’s like these women we are doing all the hard things all the emotional labor but eventually and we are overly we want to fix all the things we don’t want anyone to be in pain we’re giving auto advice we’re auto accommodating other situations so that there’s no conflict we’re always eyes always open for like well could there be a problem let me see

37:49

how i can help make sure there’s not a problem oh and listen you don’t have to have all of those symptoms fully raised i am dancing in heels backwards for sure while you’re doing the podcast yeah but that’s really what it is and so in if you identify with that folks listening if you go holy crap that’s me i’m doing all the things i’m trying to fix i don’t want people to be in pain i feel like when something bad is happening to someone else the urgency i feel feels like it’s happening to me

38:33

so those are all indications of codependency and then you have the over and under function which we had already talked about a little bit is part of codependency also um when those things are happening to another person you feel it’s your fault and that’s why you’re trying to fix it is that is that part of it like you you often feel like guilt you’re the cause for people’s you take responsibility for people’s moods whether they’re good or bad is that is that a bit of it too yes that

39:03

that itself is codependency right if someone comes home if your person comes home and you’re in a fine mood and they’re in a terrible mood if suddenly your fine mood is evaporated and you’re like oh can i make you a drink do you want a cup of tea do you want to talk about it you want to have sex whatever whatever it is that you’re trying to do because you’re uncomfortable and you do feel responsible now your own flavor of if you feel the cause of it that can be an indication of other things sometimes that’s a yes

39:36

um but i find that with most people who don’t have also have like worthiness and shame stuff even though that’s in there it’s this this over developed sense of responsibility to fix it to fix it to to make the pain stop to but when you really think about it really what are we doing we’re enabling them to not ever hit their their edges yeah and we’re also it’s worse than enabling because we’re taking away their opportunity for growth you know i had a therapist one say to me i was codependently connected to one of

40:14

my sisters who was in a bad situation and living with someone who was abusive and had no running water in the woods and was on crack like not getting like no embellishing that was the actual situation and i was crying to my therapist being like i don’t know what to do i want to give her money i want it whatever like how how is she doing this and why why doesn’t she know how wrong it is like all the things and then we got to a point where she was like terry i want to ask you a question what makes you think

40:42

that you know what jenna needs to learn in this life yeah like we’re basically playing god yes because we’re trying to control so we feel safe that’s exactly right for me the the feelings of codependency come up when someone comes home in a bad mood or i leave someone’s house and i pick up that they’re in a bad mood instead of trying to fix it i tend to go in the what could i have done wrong like and i retrace all my steps and then instead of trying to fix it i’m in freeze mode because i’m worried that i

41:11

did something wrong so i don’t necessarily like tend to be fixer i just i tend to make it worse by you know uh ma in a sense it’s very selfish because i’m making it about me you know instead of trying to help in a sense yeah but here’s the thing they’re both they’re both about you whether it’s you or whether it’s me doing that right they’re both about us that person being in pain is creating pain for me i really want my pain to end that’s what my therapist was like you’ve worked for

41:40

20 years to create internal peace and a harmonious life and your sister’s dumpster fire of a life is like [ __ ] with your peace that’s it that’s what’s happening you want your pain to stop you want her to get it together so that your pain can stop now at first i was like oh well that’s not nice like you know suddenly i was like so i’m not mother teresa like i love to think of myself as and she was like nope but it also let me off the hook and she was like it’s you can’t even fix it tara like it’s not even within

42:15

the realm of possibility but you can believe in her and you can speak to her strengths and you can remove yourself if talking to her about this abusive idiot is too painful step back and i did all of those things and nine months later she left him got sober and it’s been sober ever since then many years ago wow and i love that thought um that you said that we’re robbing them of their growth because typically in our minds we think we’re encouraging their growth so that is that’s such an important part i

42:46

i want to just you know that idea of first of all just assessing what can i control what can’t i control is like a big part of what you’re saying there i think but also i love that you bring up that mother teresa idea because that that idea of altruism is we start feeling guilty for prioritizing ourselves because we think we it makes us selfish somehow right like we think that if we’re not giving more to others than we’re giving to ourselves then we’re selfish and that’s kind of madness like how could we ever

43:16

give to others if we aren’t full you know yes and the thing is we don’t because what we end up doing is you know that is a one-way ticket to bitterland or martyrland as i like to say because the truth is you’re you won’t have you will be beam counting you will be i can’t believe betty after all i’ve done for her like literally that’s what you become and you’re like yeah oh my god wow that’s so true when you take care of yourself though yeah you can give from a place of choice not a

43:48

place of fear i’m giving because i’m afraid if i don’t you’ll project me not a place of need the need to be needed which has a lot to do with the codependency stuff giving from a place of free will love choice a decision a mindful decision and you can choose to continue doing anything you want in your life if according to me that choice is mindful so this book is going to help you get off automatic pilot get out of these default positions that are not in your highest good and not in the highest good of the people in your life

44:25

that’s the irony of the whole thing as you were just saying right is that it really doesn’t make good relationships it makes you feel like no one can ever be grateful enough or um be thankful enough because you’re giving from a disordered place and we’d be trying to be the bitter resentful yeah person and we’re like you’re saying we’re starving them but we’re just creating a cycle to continue this on instead of and teaching it to our children yeah on the show like choosing short-term

44:56

suffering versus long-term long-term suffering yes yeah yeah so i haven’t gotten to this part in your book yet but if you are a high functioning codependent is there action is there an action plan in your book oh yes there is okay but always every single thing that i teach you in the book the book is itself is built on these five pillars of self-mastery that i created years ago that i teach everything this way so we start with self-awareness and then we move into self-knowledge by doing all these inventories and going into the basement

45:30

of your mind and getting vital data that we didn’t have but is in there you just got to find it right so self-knowledge and then the third one is self-acceptance because it can be hard if we didn’t have like the picture perfect childhood if we feel like we want to protect the parental impactors now we’re like but now they’re great and that was 20 years ago why do i gotta there’s so many ways that we deny ourselves acceptance and that really provokes the child within like that’s we’re like why am i

46:01

i’m five why do i have to suck it up you know so it’s important these self-exceptions and then the fourth one is self-compassion where the whole entire time throughout this process i’m encouraging you to become super curious become the observer of yourself and your reactions without judgment curiosity compassion love for that little you because she’s still in there like stop judging stop being so friggin punitive and mean to yourself about what you should have known or what you should have done self-compassion i think this is at least

46:39

with my therapy class this has been maybe the most challenging one to get them to stop it’s almost like that internal mean committee we think makes us you know strive towards excellence or something but it really doesn’t they just suck and they just suck the joy out of life so self-compassion is really important and then the fifth one is self-mastery which includes self-love and self-celebration right because you’re uniquely you and that’s amazing forget compare and despair like that is such [ __ ] yeah what you said

47:14

there about the inner critic i deeply relate to we we jade and i have an intuitive that we see and she’s like your inner critic needs to see it very loud yeah put it on the shelf shush all right terry sit down uh in your book you reference boundary destroyers and that the normal rules of boundary engagement don’t apply so what is a boundary destroyer this sounds like i’m i’m picturing just like a hulk oh like knocking down walls or like a narcissist that like prays on those yeah okay yes jade that that is correct

47:53

the boundary destroyers are super difficult personalities they are the could be narcissistic personality disorder could be histrionic could be bipolar could be just some people who are just super oppositional super difficult i’ve really put them in the category of emotional predators though because they see the weakness they see the sweetness the empaths the highly sensitive folks they see us right they’re like yay this is where i’m gonna they’re gonna do all the things for me and so this again is where a lot of

48:28

times you’ll have uh narcissists and empaths and codependents getting together and it’s it’s like the perfect you know it’s like a match made in heaven until all hell breaks loose as i have to say because it does but it’s like the person who’s like can’t wait for it to be all about me and then the other person being like can’t wait for it to be all about you and you can only do that for so long so why the the regular rules of engagement right healthy boundary engagement that i’m teaching you

48:54

throughout the book how to make a proactive boundary success plan a whole chapter of a billion and seven scripts how to say no how to make someone stop interrupting you how to just get off the spot not not answer questions you don’t want to answer what to say if you bump into your ex who was a jerk in the supermarket like literally i covered every scenario known to mankind but in real life what you learn is that we communicate as we gave a script before about hey i’d like to make a simple request or whatever

49:28

with people who are um emotional predators if you give them any information about you a lot of times they will use it against you so these are people who are not emotionally safe people so the rules of engagement are different because i mean what i’m teaching you in the book is how to be less damaged injured hurt by boundary destroyers how not to feed into to play into what it is that they’re it could be conscious and could be unconscious right some people have no insight into their illness or into their their issue

50:11

um but you got to know that you know bashing your head up against a wall do you have a i find this with narcissistic mothers that adult daughters of narcissistic mothers it’s just so painful because the little kid just keeps being like dude maybe this time it’s gonna be different though like i just so want it to be different that you know the i wouldn’t you know i’m wanting them to protect themselves but they’re like but i think it’s and i’m like but no we have we have to look at the facts

50:43

there isn’t no evidence to tell us that there’s been any growth and that you’re this person is any safer now than they were last year or 10 years ago so there’s an acceptance there’s a there’s a stepping back from but there’s also not letting someone get away with it because there’s a difference between um and i’m not talking about listen just straight up for for complete clarity i’m not talking about if you are in any kind of a situation that is dangerous to you violent situation

51:16

all i want you to do is safely remove yourself from that situation permanently like there i don’t have any strategies boundary strategies for how to get along with an abuser i don’t because it doesn’t matter what you do if you’re in that cycle it’s unlikely that that something you’re gonna say is going to change that because it’s a cycle of abuse and it’s called that for a reason i do have um a whole vlog and a video on how to safely leave a scary situation an abusive situation and the first thing is do not tip your

51:51

hand if you’re listening to this and you’re in this don’t get all amplified and excited about setting boundaries with someone who it might put you in harm’s way don’t don’t show your cards anyway i just wanted to say that because it’s really important if someone is in a scary or an abusive situation to know that there is a way that you can safely leave i don’t think it’s likely that you can negotiate boundaries with someone like that though right yeah i think you’re talking to a big audience here that can

52:23

understand that because one of our most popular episodes was specifically about narcissistic personality disorder so i mean one of our most listened to episodes so they there’s definitely people wait as you know of course but definitely people listening to the show that are dealing with that are in maybe in the middle of it or recovering it from it yeah surviving it it’s so funny though that you say that because i was so surprised that one of my i’ve got a bunch of things on narcissism and daughters of narcissistic mothers in

52:52

particular i actually have a course called the mother wound because it is so prevalent but it is still i think i put that out three years ago four years ago every single week even though i have thousands of views it is still my most viewed youtube video wow do you find that most people that sign up for the mother wound or men or women or is it a mix it’s you know my audience i i is probably 90 90 women so and anyone’s welcome to with that but i find that the mother wound in particular even though men have it

53:27

but daughters and mothers have a very particular connection and that wound is major and there’s such a there is such the reason i did a course i didn’t even really actually want to but my audience was like but we really want one because i was like i’m so busy i got the book i’m just going to do something light no it ended up being like six full modules i was like stop pretending you’re ever doing anything light because right but you can heal from a mother wound and one really powerful thing that you

54:01

can do is find like a chosen family like find good replacements but i always looked for warm men in authority like who who would talk who were the opposite of my father and there’s something so healing about seeing like oh someone could be like this too so find a friend who’s maternal and be mindful that you also might draw other narcissistic bossy controlling quote-unquote friendships yeah it’s also in a way our like psyche asking us to heal it so that we stop doing that and i think your friend is it the same northrop that

54:47

wrote the mother-daughter book that’s actually her mother so my friend we’re about to move into our last little lightning round questions that we ask everybody at the end of the show but i was curious really quick the book non-violent communication is so much about you know non-aggressive ways of speaking and i’m curious if when you really adopt that way of communication if people feel does that make you more prone to people pushing your boundaries do you think or no because here’s the thing you know i

55:26

actually um quote marsha rosenberg in the book i actually i give as one of the the strategies he they’re very much like his his theory is very much like i’m just going to talk true i’m going to i’m going to do this neutrally i’m going to not judge i’m going to say hey when i came in and i opened the refrigerator door and i saw that there was no groceries i realized you must not have gone shopping i felt this that even you know obviously the person must have said they were gonna go shopping or whatever so it’s

55:59

it’s stating all these things his you know i’d like to make a simple request though is also something from non-violent communication which i love i think that there’s no one-size-fits-all i think that you you know i give you a lot of different strategies in the book and a million different scripts that you can make your own so i do a lot of sentence starters because a lot of times we just we just don’t know what to say to get started like yeah we need that how to i love that yeah i need that tangible

56:30

how-to for sure yes and if you just had five that were your go-to it would i promise you the next time you were in a situation and you wanted to say something it would literally if you practice it with each other in the mirror it would just fall out of your mouth naturally it’s so weird clients will be so blown away and i’m like no but you set the stage by having the words you’re literally telling your child within you and you’re you’re putting your stake in the universe you know putting your stake

57:00

in the ground saying i’m that is my limit i’m not going to act like this person didn’t just say something that i found offensive or lewd or rude or racist or whatever like i’m saying not cool no uncle bob no no i’m not doing that or whatever the thing is you know because that’s that’s another thing that people really struggle with boundary wise is what do i say what if i don’t want to talk about it what if someone asked me why am i not married why don’t i want kids did i gain weight you know how much

57:34

money do i make and if you’re a good girl sometimes you answer and then later you want to just punch yourself in the face you’re like why did i let them you know but it isn’t letting them it’s when you’re prepared you’ll you will say that’s interesting why would you ask me that yeah instead of answering that’s a good one yeah yeah that actually that is kasha urbaniac you guys would love her if you don’t know her she’s a power dynamic expert who was a dominatrix for many years

58:09

studied all over the world with all of these power like in you know female monks in china like she’s so brilliant and her work i also have that in the book there’s just this thing about how do you get off the spot when someone says something really messed up to you like how do you not let them dominate you and she really teaches about power dynamics that by just saying why would you want to know that you now have flipped the script and now you’re the dominant one and they’re in the submissive position yeah and the

58:43

most important thing is don’t answer the mother f in question if you do not want that person having that information about you right but her work is great yeah comes right up our alley i know just i am i’ve i’ve been transgressing myself more than anyone’s been transgressing me so i gotta definitely figure out my boundaries so getting that book getting all the tools and that’s going to happen i’m going to report to you terry on how that goes or i’m following up i want so i have one cell phone

59:13

number i need the other one i’m going to be texting you ladies absolutely yeah thank you so okay we have just a few short questions here at the end to ask you and the first one is if you could hug your younger self right now what would you say to her oh you’re the best you’re so awesome you’re amazing just keep doing what you’re doing mm-hmm yeah a lot of little girls have actually never heard that yeah i know i i hadn’t if you could have the whole world read one book which would it be oh right now

59:47

it’d be boundary box yeah and if you want to get that go to boundarybossbook.com yes yeah it’s on pre-order right now right is it actually just dropped on the 20th oh awesome okay it’s available yeah perfect and if you could whisper one phrase to anyone and everyone on the planet what would it be you are worthy that’s really good i hope all of our listeners really felt that before we let you go where can people find you online well i want them to go find the gift that i’m going for giving to you guys

1:00:22

because we’re going to do the one on uh boundaries and codependency because i think that was a lot of what we talked about i think that will help go to boundary boss dot me forward slash magic spell the way these ladies spell it m a j i c yes we’re gonna put it in the show notes we’ll link that there as well so you can just click below and find that boundary boss dot me slash magic yeah exactly terry we also we follow you on instagram and love your content there as well so our followers can find you

1:00:54

there also um you are just an absolute light in this world and i’m so glad we’ve come across your work uh and i know it’s going to be something that really deepens my own journey and my own healing with myself so thank you thank you thank you for doing the work that you are doing you are definitely really changing lives yeah i’m so happy thank you guys so much for having me and for helping me get it out there i really do appreciate it absolutely thank you we’ll talk to you soon yes you will

1:01:24

so we will be uh sending you the well we’re airing this pretty quickly right jay uh not this monday coming up but the monday after so i think that’s may 11th um okay i had may third here so just change it to the 11th so my team knows oh no it is may 3rd isn’t it oh is it yeah i think you have it on hold on let me just oh you’re right i’m sorry it’s may 3rd it’s okay yeah no problem i just got to confirm everything that i do so that they that your page is live we have all the things that you need i think

1:01:50

your your people are going to love it though yeah i do for sure yeah so may 3rd and we’ll make a pretty cool promo and be tagging you up a storm in that online so yay you guys this was so fun and amazing and i so appreciate that you’re this young generation who gives a [ __ ] about your mental health and about boundaries and that you you know i’m doing this thing with um some some other people some of the ladies from you know the almost 30 podcast oh yeah they’re awesome but you guys are like in the same age

1:02:21

and so i feel like you should be a part of this too where i’m creating it’s called um boundary boss next gen and it’s going to be a very affordable four i say four modules whatever it’s probably 10 modules for like 30 bucks but and i’m doing specifically the things that are not in the book that are negatively impacting your generation so boundaries in social media breaking away from your family of origin boundaries and relationships boundaries with friends so right and then i would ask you guys

1:02:53

what are your thoughts of or am i are we missing something those guys we’re going to do like a quick survey to their audience but i’m pretty clear like i feel like you know that’s it so i’ll send you guys an email okay and if you’re interested in and really the i really just want to pick your brains and see what what are the pain points for your audience yeah because it is a specific age where even if there wasn’t covid even if we weren’t in the world that we’re in right now that

1:03:25

20s into early 30s is this life transition phase and there’s a lot to negotiate so anyway just planting that in your ear yeah yeah send it over and let’s let’s definitely dance with that because that sounds awesome yeah we love you i mean we’ll figure out how to work something out yeah i love it i love you guys too you are so welcome i appreciate you i’ll be in touch for show okay okay great we’ll talk to you soon bye bye all right man she reminded me of like it was someone from a movie that some like

1:03:57

powerful woman but like the conscious version like i don’t know if it was like the conscious version of like the woman and devil wears product or maybe like you know what i mean like i got that so i’m like so like powerhouse but like very conscious in it you know yes and again one of my articulation goals for sure i don’t think she said um or but or any of these oh lord beautiful beautiful work though i am seriously digging so deep into her work of late because i know this is a place that my um my trends like i was saying like

1:04:28

where i trespass myself and where i’m trespassed by others well i’m not even trespassed by this because i haven’t set any boundaries so obviously i need to do some work because i just get bitter and resentful because i don’t have any healthy boundaries yet so here we go yeah and my magic trick i know i think i think yours is is pulled from her i know mine is but it’s why healthy relationships may feel boring so it’s you know if if you i guess these are things to remember if you feel your healthy relationship is

1:04:59

boring i know that and my relationship in the very beginning i would get kind of like i wanted some more entertainment or like some excitement or something i but a lot of the times it’s it just feels boring because we’re so used to chaos so yes so these are reasons why healthy relationships feel boring and these are things that we can just remember okay so if parents or caretakers were inconsistent in meeting your needs then hot and cold behaviors feel familiar to you and you associate consistency with

1:05:34

incompatibility okay so that’s one thing to remember i’m only listing three the second one is your early environment felt unsafe so you turn to fantasy as a coping mechanism which then means you idealize relationships as an escape from reality and then the third one the last one is you learn to perform in order to win love and i know we talked a lot about that today but basically that causes you to associate love with self-sacrifice and then you struggle to be yourself with partners you don’t need to perform for

1:06:05

so all these things being absent in your healthy relationship may feel boring but if you can remember that you’re just lacking the chaos that gave you the thrill you may find that it’s you know it’s not a relationship that that’s so freaking powerful because seriously i have been that’s from her instagram beautifully i told you you gotta follow her yeah i have been in a relationship where i was legit was probably the most you know kind of even keeled relationship i’ve ever been in of my you know track record and

1:06:40

definitely a secure attachment style like to someone who is very very grounded and for me i was like there’s like no passion here this is getting boring and of course not till many many years later where i started doing this work where i realized it was just me trying to stir [ __ ] up because that’s what felt like home to me chaos felt like home because that is much closer to the way that i was brought up and much closer to the relationships i witnessed growing up um that looked like you know the they were the model

1:07:14

relationship growing up it wasn’t it was an ideal uh not an ideal relationship but that to me really hit hard and i’ve had to do a lot of work to unwind that idea that we have to be always in conflict or somehow cold and hot or someone has to be in a bad mood in order for the relationship to have yeah and then it you know some people they may try to run away from the healthy relationship or some people may try to add chaos so that it’s not boring you know like they add the conflict so i think there’s also a factor in there

1:07:44

terry i definitely have heard her talk about this a lot where when we slow down enough in a relationship or call or are calm enough in a relationship or there isn’t all that turbulence it causes us to actually have to be intimate the thing we’re asking for all the time like why can’t we just stop fighting why can’t this just be peaceful when we’re always fighting then when it actually happens in a relationship or you find a relationship where it’s already pretty peaceful you freak out because you’re like oh

1:08:11

wait i don’t know how to be like intimate with myself and know myself this way and be quiet here and not have to blame others and all these things and just all the [ __ ] bubbles up that we have to kind of figure out how much of it is ours to take responsibility for so oh i love that magic trick for sure yeah thank you so mine mine is not from terry specifically um it’s kind of like a combination of stuff i’ve been working on and uh yeah it is around boundaries specifically with family members and um

1:08:43

it is something that terry does talk about though so i don’t want to say she doesn’t cover this because she certainly will she does all things boundaries i can’t even believe how much there is to learn about boundaries yeah um so this is what you know if you’re asking yourself the question what should you do if a family member doesn’t respect a boundary which if you’ve tried setting any boundaries of your own you’re going to learn real quick that the people in your life are not going to be used to that and they’re

1:09:11

going to resist them for sure and you’re not going to respect them easily so first off obvious obviously try restating the boundary see if that makes any difference but do any of us like boundaries no because it’s it’s cause i was thinking earlier like well i don’t like when my boyfriend sets boundaries or tells me like this isn’t gonna work but and then i was like [ __ ] am i a narcissist and i thought well if i was i wouldn’t be having this conversation with myself and so so maybe it’s just normal that we don’t

1:09:38

like boundaries right yeah it’s not it’s not it’s normal that we don’t like anything that causes us discomfort or that causes change because that yeah is uncomfortable to our ego so either way this is common in families totally common and you’re not doing it wrong because this is all a dance it’s an experiment and it’s not perfect but we can learn a lot from terry in this episode today and her book and all the good things so obviously if you’re not getting your boundaries respected

1:10:07

first thing to do is try restating the boundary if that makes a difference fantastic if not if there’s like a repeated disregard or inability for that for the family member to respect the boundary sometimes it is going to be walking away from the relationship that’s needed or at least for a period of time that may be a necessary step to take and this can look like a family member repeatedly sending mean text messages and when this happens it’s recommended that the recipient the recipient expresses i am not responding and will be blocking

1:10:42

your number for the next 24 hours we can speak again when things have cooled down a bit if you that the point is there you know this is hard to do though it feels scary to do that right but oh i do that boundary all the time if you can clearly state your boundaries and they’re still not respected it could help to send the message like that where you’re stating the intention to take some distance while you’re also you know obviously you’re choosing to do that and you’re making it clear to them that

1:11:12

you’re not fully abandoning them right like so it’s just a time to cool down yeah and if they subsequently continue to contact you obviously don’t engage with them because you’ve already made your stance clear this is where you do the actual work of holding your boundary because if you further engage with them then it’s likely to reinforce that there’s going to be some sort of ongoing connection and that can get really confusing and i think that’s a big deal with boundaries is like don’t make it confusing be

1:11:41

really clear with setting the expectations and your intentions hold the boundary because that’s so you don’t transgress and trespass yourself really more than anything and you don’t want to make it confusing for the other person who you would like to help them learn how to love you better so um you know like i said this still sets the way the way of doing it that i just explained still sets a boundary while not abandoning the person who you’re trying to set it with and it allows space for both of the people to

1:12:09

process the conflict before addressing it again however if it’s not an isolated incident and you continue to run into the same issues you may need to remove yourself from the situation and cut off all contact for a longer period of time if not permanently so that sometimes is the issue and it’s important to note that sometimes the amount of pain and anguish caused by a familial relationship may mean it is not worth continuing that’s super hard to swallow because like we’re talking about with um terry

1:12:39

it can feel like death to say no to some of the people in our lives like it can really feel like this that fear of abandonment that you think is going to be the result of you saying no or not you know showing up for whatever they’re asking you to show up for it can feel literally so painful like so scary that you think if i don’t do this my whole life’s gonna fall apart right so it is about getting that that mindfulness gap and like really looking at it and being like is this reasonable my response here like terry was talking

1:13:10

about so in scenarios like this where it feels that um that aggressive and that big for you to hold speaking with a professional or seeking therapy is obviously a great resource and to help you decide what to do next yeah and for the men listening uh you know codependency and boundaries are a lot of the things that the work we’re doing in our workshop awakening within are very healing force so i know we mentioned it at the top of the show but if this you know episode really resonated with you and you feel like you

1:13:41

have a lot of you know the the stuff that we talked about in here that obviously mercedes and i said that we both struggle with the work that we will do together in the workshop is a huge starting point for healing that and for developing the confidence needed um and the the self-respect needed to set those boundaries so go you know sign up for that and and um i know it will aid in this part of your healing journey yeah and that can be done guys at awakeningkings.

1:14:14

com get on the early bird list do not miss out because spots are limited and they are going fast we are almost full to capacity awakening kings.com put your email in the early bird list gives you a 24 hour pre-access to purchasing the course we will definitely be in there doing the work with you and by the way it’s totally anonymous if you so choose yeah there will be uh we don’t know your identity or any of those things i know for a lot of people they aren’t super comfortable um getting into these different therapies and

1:14:43

modalities yet yeah and if you’re listening to this and you realize like crap it already started there’s going to be a playback for the call one so you’ll be able to listen back on that and you can join us for the next couple of calls that like mercedes said can be anonymous all right magic mobbers thank you so much for tuning in and taking this journey with us if this episode held some magic for you please share it with your friends and family this would mean so much for us and don’t forget to join

1:15:07

us on our instagram page at the magic hour and let us know what your favorite episodes have been so far we appreciate all of your feedback and want to know what is lighting you up yes fam and you know it means the world to us when you just send us that five star um on apple podcast or write us a little review and let us know what you like about the show or just put a heart in there and say we love you guys because that is what gets our show to reach other people that might be needing this information about boundaries today

1:15:38

we love you love you love you fam we release a new episode every monday you can catch us again next week or you can go listen to some of our past episodes in our podcast library now and until then be a lie delight all right you want to read her bio real quick and then i have to rush out because i’m much farther from the kids school now you got all the way down to let’s get her on right yeah all you have to do is read her bio yes let’s do it she is a new york-based licensed psychotherapist relationship

1:16:20

expert and founder of real love revolution boundary boot camp and the co-founder of crushing codependency her female empowerment courses reach people in over 90 countries prior to her current incarnation as a love and boundaries expert she was a bi-coastal talent agent negotiating endorsement contracts for supermodels and celebrities pretty cool her eventual disenchantment with the world of entertainment led her to change careers in her 30s to become a psychotherapist and empowerment expert and she has since made it her

1:16:56

mission to teach as many women as possible to establish and maintain effective boundaries with ease and create a i’m going to just redo this part you have to tell john she has since made it her mission to teach as many people as possible to establish and maintain effective boundaries with ease and create and sustain healthy vibrant relationships for the past two decades she has worked with some of the world’s most well-known personalities from international pop stars athletes broadway performers and tv personalities to thought leaders and

1:17:31

fortune 500 ceos she empowers over 250 000 people weekly through her published articles and blog posts illuminating videos therapeutic meditations online courses and her popular podcast the terry cole show she has been featured as an expert therapist and master life coach on a e’s monsters in-laws tedx the lisa oz show real housewives and had a weekly radio show on hay house radio plus she’s a regular contributor to the huffington post positively positive the daily love well and good and has been featured in

1:18:12

italian l forbes origen vogue self and was honored to grace the cover of inspired coach magazine what a resume but on a more personal note y’all i have been studying this woman’s work for healing my own struggles with codependency and people-pleasing and have found immense healing through it so i knew it was important we reached out and asked her to come on the show so we could share her wisdom with our world here that’s you guys so with that please help us welcome terry cole to the magic hour